TheBiologySpace.BioBlog

The enviroment is much more important- although it’s cool to look at art, if we’re helping spawn some demon fungi that harms humans, art needs to come second. Plus, we’ve got the picture copies of all the art- keeping the real thing around… well, it’s a little silly.Not that humans don’t tend to gravitate towards superfluous looks (I mean, that IS art)… anyways, it’s just stupid kinda. Close off the cave, and if the fungi gets too much of a problem, I bet they could burn it off.
I don’t think any fungi is resistant to fire.:)

Honestly i think that the public should be able to see these remarkable landmarks in history. Lascaux for example should be open to the public, think about how much revenue would be brought in. Obviously whoever left these markings/paintings wanted people in the future to notice them so they can be remembered…
Therefore i only find it fair that they are open for the world to view.

This article is very interesting and boy Mrs. Ferguson have you brought up some intriguing questions. I believe that both preservation of history and ecosystem are both very important, but i don’t know how both can happen in this particular scenario with Lascaux…
Unless…..
I have a brilliant idea……
We can have one person walk into the cave with a camera and record everything in the cave. Set it up on iTunes. Have people pay to download it. BOOM!
I’m a genius….

But as for which should be preserved, I would have to go with history and culture because that is where we came from and who we used to be. As Thomas Jefferson said, we must know our past so we don’t make the same mistakes in our present…
Or at least somebody said something like that….

But personally, it doesn’t make a difference one way or another for me. I just find these paintings as another form of art. Preserving culture, history, ecosystems, or environments isn’t that important to me.
Like I always say, whatever floats yo boat g-dub.

I don’t think the caves should be open to the public, or, at the least, not for the entire year. By limiting the amount of time spent in the cave, humans will not cause any imbalance in the ecosystem and create further damage for the cave walls.

I think that this representation of art, being the first, is vital to humanity and all steps should be taken to keep the paintings around. I looked up the caves and found a few images of the paintings. These really are stunning depictions of the enviroment and local wildlife. I was wondering what kind of paint the artists used in these works.

The carbon dioxide from public visitations is not the only factor that has affected the preservation of the paintings; global warming has grown to be a main factor as well. Apparently, more than half of the organisms identified in the microbial samples from the cave proved to be harmful, and can potentially cause diseases.

After reading about the Lascaux Caves, I found it quite interesting that professionals wonder what is more dangerous — “treating or not treating.” As with any other situation, pros and cons are presented with either decision, which must be carefully weighed.

Balancing public enjoyment and desire for visitations with preserving the natural balances of the cave proves to be extremely difficult, let alone choosing one over the other. Apparently, the fiberglass of the replica cave shows signs of wear and tear as well. If fiberglass is impacted by the constant visitation of the public, imagine the probable damage to the real cave if kept open to the public.

From an archaeological standpoint, I believe the preservation of history and culture. Prehistory, the age before written records is hard to come by in terms of discernible evidence. In order for us, as a race, to understand where we are going, we need to understand our true past and the essence of our ancestors’ lives. I do qualify though, accounting for the fact that the ecosystem is equally as important, because as more people behold these glorious prehistorical paintings, the more damage to the paintings occurs. Whether it be the indirect microbes humans bring in the caves, or the direct actions of the scientists to inhibit them with biocides, the evidence of our past is essentially disintegrating because of recent actions. The caves should not be open to the public because of previous careless behavior over a span of 60 years, except to archaeologists and scientists…in a limited number. For an incalculable amount of time, the caves have stood, strong, proud, and as a symbol of that time period. If they are truly of historical and cultural significance, then it should be understood unanimously that in order to acknowledge this symbolism, we must let them be that, instead of a novel tourist attraction, easily accesible to humans and their microbes.

It’s a difficult call to make the choice between preserving the ecosystem and preserving culture. Personally I think we meddle too much in the environment as it is, that’s why we must continuously work to correct what we’ve messed up which in turn makes the problems escalate exponentially. These ancient historical sites should not be open to the public at all- if we truly want to preserve our natural history on this planet, we’d leave it alone. Sure archaeologists and historians should be allowed to study it, but the public can get their information from the scholars. Turning an historical site into a tourist trap is an injustice to mankind’s history and a discredit to us as a species- marveling at our early ancestors like hollywood celebrities. Sites like the ones in Carlsbad and Lascaux should be respected and not superficially appraised.

Isn’t it interesting how many unique and thought-changing things are uncovered or discovered by accident? And by teens, no less. Though I’m not surprised that the caves were not open to the public until after WWII, considering what was going on at the time.

So after 23 years, mankind realized that it was because of carbon dioxide given off by tourists that the art in the caves was disappearing. And even after the caves were closed off, a fungus had begun to infest. I wonder, if no one had visited the caves, would the art have suffered as much? Would the fungus have appeared and infested? Is it completely the fault of tourists for the degradation of the paintings? It seems the caves and the bacteria within it are fighting back for the intrusion.

It’s a very delicate situation, wanting to explore our past and at the same time try and preserve that which is keeping it safe. It seems that every time humans attempt to do something good for themselves – like further our knowledge of the past and its culture – we upset the balance of that ecosystem that we intruded upon. Is there something in science that could capture the culture that humans want to know about but at the same time can preserve the environment that surrounds it?

I think that preservation of history and culture and preservation of ecosystems and enviroment, in this case, are the same. If the cave is open to the public then the painting will deteriorate, as also with the ecosystems; they are tied together. Unfourtunately right now science cannot have both. The painting are priceless and would be a shame to ruin for the generations to come.

People should not be allowed in the caves, at least not into the areas in which the drawings exist. The installation of a ventilation system is not worth the money or the time to allow thousands of people to eventually destroy a rare and fragile peice of history. Preservation of the environment should always rule out the glorification of a culture.

This drawing seems very primitive and can provide insight on the types/kinds of animals back when early humans first roamed the earth. Drawings like these usually depict what humans did, whether it be war, killing animals for food, or coming to this place. I wonder if there is any record of how these early humans came to this place back 20,000 years ago. If there is, I would like to know. Thanks.

This is a serious problem, not only for the cave paintings, but for the human population as well. Yes, we are observing precious memories thousands of years old by seeing them close up, but we cannot learn from them if they deteriorate while we see them. History is a lesson: if we do not learn from the past, we will make the same mistakes the early humans did and this in our time could cause our extinction. Reflecting on the past is just as important as looking towards the future.

This is unfortunate that the caves have been altered by human intervention. This is an example for future generations to learn from while realizing the consiquences before they interfere with historical and cultural novilties.

To me, I believe preserving culture and history is more imporant. The scientists have probably already collected all kinds of data on these cave drawings and so now, its time for the public to enjoy them. I believe that if no one enjoys these paintings, learning from their deep history and culture, then the preservation of them will be irrelevent to the future generations who will have no appreciation for the culture.

It is so interesting learning about our ancestors and their way of life, but if there were no protection of the ecosystem, what would be the point of learning about the history? The destruction of such things would come about before any complete understanding would. I love going to the Inner Space Caverns near Austin, but if my health or the history of the cavern were to my knowledge in jeopardy I would probably never visit. It’s so sad that it seems we must decide between the two. If they had never desired to share their paintings, they never would have painted them.

I have never heard of these caves in France, but they sound very interesting. I think it’s interesting that the scientists and historians are questioning whose work is more harmful. Things like this don’t usually happen, they are usually worried about themselves and their research.

I think that the public should be able to see the caves. They haven’t been open in a while and I think they can find a way to allow people to see the history without damaging the paintings. There is so much technology out there, I believe it is possible.

I agree with Nadeem. Clearly the drawings are meant to be seen. Eventually, regardless of human intrusion, the paintings will naturally fade or something could happen to the cave. We may as well explore and learn about them now before it’s too late and we miss the opportunity to do so.

hey nice idea! haha. But I mean if it’s the content in the cave that people are interested in, I see no issue in recording videos and taking tons of pictures to preserve them. Yeah the cave is awesome, but nothing lasts forever. To me it’s kind of like we would inhibit first-hand learning by not allowing people to experience the paintings while it’s still available

The caves should be open to all peoples for “caveat emptor” is a popular saying. For those who don’t know what this means, its buyer beware. The people should be able to see these caves if they are informed of the risks and commit to a liability type lease. This goes without saying that the people should not be protected, suits that prevent contamination and seals to protect camera-ware should be provided in an effort to reduce the chance to spread disease. Also a decontamination site, like in Monster’s Inc. where they scrub down the monster for having a human sock, should be in place in before and after the visits to ensure a sterile environment for the visitor.

I think this place should remain open but only during certain periods of the year. They could try to introduce bacteria that wouldn’t harm the paintings but would kill the bacteria that are harming the bacteria that hurt the paintings. Maybe they could build a seal around paintings that would keep out the microbes people are brining into the cave.

The cave paintings are a rare and precious look into our past as humans so of course they would be a popular tourist attraction. I agree with Sarah and Hannah that they should be only be accessible to archaeoligists/researchers because the damage caused by the public traffic is only ruining what we find so interesting. This would also allow the ecosystem within the caves and prevent the release of potentially harmful fungi, benefitting both the historical preservation and the environment. I would rather look at pictures of the paintings knowing they still exist in good condition than know I was damaging them by visiting in person.

I think the paintings are amazing, but seriously, how much importance are they compared to the environment. Are old paintings more important than the ecosystem. NO

Well, it is kinda neat that something created by humans thosands of years ago, them just depicting there everyday life the only thing that really mattered at the time, was ruined by their offspring that are too concered with the past thosands of years later.

I believe the caves should remain open to the public because the people who created this art meant for it to be seen for generations to come and to give insight on how they lived. I think we must take greater precautions on protecting the precious paintings and the many people that visit. While preservation of the ecosystem and environment would be the moral thing to do, i believe that preserving the history and culture holds a greater significance in the world.

I believe that they should keep the caves closed so that we are able to conduct more research. Also because there are diseases that could hurt humans there should be less interaction between us and the cave.

I had no idea that the people back then had such good art skiils. Or paint. Seriously, though, these drawings are much better than I would expect from cavemen, as when I think of cave paintings, I think of 3-4 stick figures holding sticks chasing a mammoth, or something. Then again, my experience with cave paintings is only from cartoons.

I believe that science wont allow us to both preserve the history and preserve the ecosystems mainly because the interference of one of these factors leads to problems with the other. Scientists have to think deeply whether or not they should close off the caves or allow people to see history.

I think that the caves should be open to the public, but have the walls seperated from the tourists by a glass wall, or something, with no air or anything getting to the paintings. That way, everyone wins, as we could see the originals, but not harm them!

Well the obvious choice to preserve to this primitive Picasso’s pictures, (that’s right I’ve got mad alliteration skills). If we let people go to these caves then we would essentially destroy this priceless artifact.

In such a case as this with the cave drawings and history at risk, the cave should be closed so that visitors don’t disturb the history. The cave should be inspected by professionals and if a fungicide is necessary to preserve the drawings of the cave then apply it. The point is that these cave drawings are obviously important to history and may be worth more to history than entertainment.

I like Andrew’s idea of a “decontamination site, like in Monster’s Inc.”!!! But that seems like a solution for humans only. What about the ecosystems that were are putting in unbalance because of our curiosity? I do think the caves should be open to the public but before we can do that we need to find a way to protect what’s there already. This is such a clash between our interests and the interest of the ecosystems. It seems that we will lose either way because either we don’t get to see these paintings which are thought to be an excellent insight into human life at that time or we completely ruin the caves because of all the harm we are causing it just by being there.

I also think it’s super interesting that these caves are in France. I always think of things like this appearing in Africa or the Middle East. If the comprehension of prehistoric times is only instilled in the minds of very few, than maybe those are the only beings that should marvel at such amazing findings and the visitors find interest in the models.

Well I think it is important for people to be able to observe these paintings. However, if so many problems have occurred maybe it is not the best idea. It is not worth damaging the cave walls just for visitors to view the drawings. In addition, future generations will not be able to see the paintings if they are destroyed by too many tourists.

I think they should definitely not let people continue viewing the caves. I do think it is a good thing that a replica is on display. By doing this, people can still enjoy the paintings without damaging the cave walls.

I personally believe we should be living in the moment. If there is something to be learned from these drawings, then by all means, study them and learn from them. But opening the area to the public at the risk of an ecosystem is just ridiculous. They lived. They died. Lets do the same.

I wonder if the biocidal chemicals also contributed to the degradation of the art.

Has the replica cave also had this fungal problem?

It’s definitely unfortunate that the cave paintings have been destroyed by the fungus and that the problem was exacerbated by the new ventilation system. It’s kind of bizarre that this was allowed to happen, though. I would have thought that the people in charge would have taken precautions so as to avoid such problems…

These caves hold valuable historical evidence and we should do as much as possible to protect this environment while still allowing those willing to enter the cave explore. The brave people should be provided with the proper equipment so they do not contaminate anything as Andrew suggested.

Visiting the cave to look at the paintings is a great way for us to learn about history and culture. However, scientists and historians need to work together to preserve the cave so that our children and grandchildren have the chance to enjoy a piece of the history.

I agree with Nadeem and Victoria; people are interested in the drawings in the cave and would like to visit the cave to learn about the history and culture. If visits by humans are being harmful to the ecosystem of the cave then visits to the cave should be limited. I don’t see any problems with learning the history and culture by watching video recordings of the cave.

I think that the caves should be closed to the public. Yes it’s cool to see what our ancestors did and understand where we came from better, but not at the expense of the environment. I mean if people really want to see those drawings and preserve them forever in history, hellooo! It’s the 21st century. It’s called a camera?

To me its a no brainer that these paintings should be closed off to te public. Is it worth losing a rare piece of history so some tourists can go “Oh. Well that’s neat.” Ive seen the original U.S. Constitution in person and it is almost completely faded from years of public viewing. When are we going to learn that curiosity killed the cat and will destroy many things that we take for granted?

I agree with this, the art work in these caves were left for a reason. People thousands of years ago worked on them and it would be a shame to destroy this site of ancient culture. Although, this would be a very difficult decision to make since our environment is more important, even though the preservation of our culture is as well. It would be horrible to destroy such an old piece of our history. To kill off the beginning of evidence of us as humans seems unethical, although if it is what is necessary to save our environment then we obviously need to do what’s best for our world.

Lascaux should definitely be open to the public. if the paintings are so prestigious then we should let the people have a chance to appreciate the artwork.

I think our ancestors that left the cave drawings behind were smarter than what led on. Maybe if they examine the dyes the cave-dwellers used to create the drawings it can give insight to the tools and technology available to them.

With cave drawings as such a widespread phenomena, then i think its safe to say the people that migrated from africa were already participating in cave drawings. The ones we see today are simply reminants of a larger and more proliferated array of artwork from out antients. So i think its important to do more to preserve them.

These places should no longer be open to the public once the our presence starts to erode and ruin the original artifacts. It’s the same thing with museums, we allow people to see the famous artwork but not rub their hands all over it due to the erosion of the medium from the oils on our hands…and the CO2 that we breathe out doesn’t so much effect the pieces due to the preservation of them. And, science will help us to have both. There will be a way to find another way to kill off this bacteria besides that biocides that won’t put people in danger of a massive bacterial infection or ruin the ecosystem.

Shouldn’t the scientists that are surrounding this project have assumed that this type of prolonged and massive visitation of the public would have started to cause the paint and the walls to erode? Shouldn’t they have planned ahead for this instead of trying to fix the aftermath of already some of these paintings being ruined and now a bacteria and NOW a resistant strain of a bacteria that could infect humans? All I’m saying, is that they should have been more prepared when planning to open this up to visitation..maybe encase it in something to prevent erosion from the air.

Elaborate Huntings? HA really. Most likely this guy is just some shunned artist that did not fit in with the ways of human life. At that time human beings were just struggling to be on the totum pole.
The real unfortunate part is environment has gone untouched for so long. It is the real artwork. However i understand we do a lot to damage the world, i can even imagine a future of coast to coast concrete cities. But is this not what evolution is about. The microbes are evolving to handle the new environmental pressures, we are as much a hinderance as a volcano to a countryside or a hurricane to sea life

These caves are just one of many historical ecosystems that are being threatened by human interaction. They should continue researching biocides that will not cause the bacteria to become resistant, however they should also concentrate on other ecosystems that are “out of balance” like glaciers and the rainforest.

I think that this cave has been open long enough. There must be pictures or replicas of the historic culture somewhere in the world that can make the public equally happy and not deal with them entering the cave. Why don’t we just not go into the cave? I think our selfishness that is ruining the history in this cave and an innocent ecosystem. So we should just be the bigger species and leave it be, and understand that a culture and a tribe lived there a long time ago and drew on the walls.

I have had the chance to go to a cave, though it did not have drawings, it was amazing and quite humid. I find stories like these amazing; how something so beautiful and unique, like a cave, is formed by nature, and how the human race is able to make use of nature, live and produce in the cave, and draw their recollections on walls. And then teenagers discover a life of the past by mistake, and find information that lives were there and their culture, is just so breathtaking for me.

I definitely do believe that the historic caves should be closed to the public. I agree with Kathryn; we can’t let our selfishness and our interest for pleasure get in the way of placing our environment in danger. I understand that history is important, especially in answering our scientific questions. But their are other ways to quench are curiosity without any detrimental consequences.

Would scientists be able to analyze the dyes used by the cavemen when they were drawn so many thousands of years ago? I don’t know if science could detect that sort of thing, only the types of tools used back then. Then again, with carbon dating, who knows what could be open to the world? If scientists could detect and come to a conclusion about the dyes used – besides guessing about cavemen using colors from plants and such – then yes, we could possibly deduce their level of intelligence and how it may exceed that which we had previously predicted and assumed.

Eventually, the cave drawings will disappear. This would have happened without human intervention, I’m sure of it. After all, it’s the life cycle: everything lives, dies, and is recycled. Though, with this case, the paintings haven’t really “lived,” though they have withstood the test of time. Though, one day, they would have eventually decayed. Humans just sped up the process. But yes, one way to preserve them through the rest of time would be to take pictures. I’m sure many people have done that already, but once the paintings are gone, they’re gone. There’s no use in trying to preserve them for a prolonged period of time when they’re going to disappear anyway.

Wasn’t this from the Journey of Man video? The narrator related these paintings to the first people to come to Europe and stay. Looking back at the age man came to Europe, early in perspective to us, but much much later in time of man. These paintings must also reveal much of their culture and knowledge back then.

Leslie pointed out what I had in mind to say…that it is not only a mere glimpse of the creatures of the time or the depicted climate, but yes…archaeologists and scientists actually are working with not only radio carbon dating, but also thermoluminescent dating in order to decode the past. The evidence in these caves yields a broad spectrum of possible future revelations such as the materials used to paint…were they indigenous to the region? if not how did they get there? … which can lead to questions arising concerning this region of peoples relationship to other tribal peoples? did they trade ? Also the form of the drawings. Owing to the Letter B script tablets found at, I believe, it was the palace at Knossos near Greece that later evolved into the Greek language as we know it; and the discovery of the Phoenician Alphabet forms, we are coming closer to tracing the evolution of the written word, for lack of a better term, as humans evolved themselves. Therefore, again I believe that the key to understand our past and future, is to preserve the caves by restricting entrance. The preservation of the ecosystem and the true “history” of these caves goes hand in hand. It is not one or the other. It is up to humans to decided whether to be selfish and view it as a tourist attraction, a fleeting glimpse at something “cool”, then forgotten, or to be graciously noble and relinquish such whims, leaving it up to the professionals to gather all the knowlege they can; because “you have to know where you come from, in order to truly know where you’re going.” :]

Humans are on the Earth just like any other animal and should be free to explore all. The preservation of the ecosystem and the environment are much more important than the history and culture because history is in the past, but the ecosystem is a constantly changing thing that needs to maintained in the present making it vastly more important. Often to have one thing, another must be given up. Even with the great strides in science, it is probably unlikely that both can be had.

I find it amusing that by trying to make everything better we’ve made everything worse. That seems to be a reoccurring theme in our history. We invade, we destroy, and we make everything worse trying to right our wrongs.